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Defining season 7 rules - Attack cap

Discussion in 'Ogre Wars' started by FoxWMB, Oct 1, 2013.

How much should the attack cap be?

Poll closed Oct 8, 2013.
  1. 45%

    12.5%
  2. 50%

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. 55%

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. 60%

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. 65%

    12.5%
  6. 70%

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  7. 75%

    37.5%
  8. 80%

    25.0%
  9. 85%

    12.5%
  10. Other

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
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  1. FoxWMB

    FoxWMB Clubbed The Pit

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    There has been quite a talk about attack cap recently, so we're going to do this poll a bit differently.
    The options are going to be exactly the same as in pre-season 6 voting. However, in order for an option to win, it will need to have over 75% of the votes. If all options have under 75% of the votes, we will take the 2 options with the most votes, and pick the middle value (for example, 60 and 80, middle value is 70) . Those 2 options will have to have over 75% votes when added together, otherwise we'll move on to 3 options and their middle value, unless top 3 options also do not have over 75%. In the end, we will pick the middle value of minimum number of options that have over 75% votes together.
    Sorry if it's confusing, but this way we will avoid the situation where an option supported by a few active members prevails over the option supported by more active members

    The poll is public, post only if you have something more to say than "I voted", posts like that will be deleted. The poll will last for 7 days
     
  2. Thedarkboy

    Thedarkboy Anime Geek Ogre Veteran

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    I've said it before, and I'll say it again. A higher attack cap is better.
    A higher attack cap would mean that the season wouldn't be over as fast as now.
    It would mean that you could knock someone out completely, for a long time, but with a higher attack cap, the person that gets attack doesn't get too far behind and still have a higher chance of catching up again.
     
  3. Webber

    Webber Ogre King Ogre Veteran

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    75% and above will help to lessen blocking strategies imo.
     
  4. FoxWMB

    FoxWMB Clubbed The Pit

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    In my opinion, 60% cap was close to optimal, but maybe too low. The point of this cap is to prevent people from wrecking those smaller than them, so keeping it too low is clearly a bad thing. However, keeping it too high provides a counter effect as it stops people from attacking, and can also give a huge advantage to nations that have bigger gold income bonuses. I saw the effects of 75% in season 4, it was too high, 60% too low, so I'd like to see 65% this season (Ideally, I'd go with 67.5% to see how it works)
     
  5. Joker

    Joker Ogre Hall of Fame Ogre Veteran

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    the higher the better for me
     
  6. FoxWMB

    FoxWMB Clubbed The Pit

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    The middle value of minimum number of options that are required to fill 75% of votes is 70, therefore the attack cap will be at 70% in season 7
     
  7. Aaddron

    Aaddron Moderator Staff Member GameOgre Moderator

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    How are 2 votes for 65% and under, outweighing 6 votes for 75%+. This middle ground sucks, it should be weighting votes not items themselves... it seems the larger the gap in the item themselves the heavier the vote is. Maybe next season it can be different? This system doesn't seem fair.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 9, 2013
  8. FoxWMB

    FoxWMB Clubbed The Pit

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    I understand what you're saying and I agree with you.
    If we were to weigh the actual votes, it would end up at 72.5%, which I suppose is a bit better.
    If you have a more fair system though, feel free to share it with us :)
     
  9. Aaddron

    Aaddron Moderator Staff Member GameOgre Moderator

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    That's not just the votes. It's 3 votes for 75%, 2 votes below and 3 above. If all votes are even then the scale goes over 75% not under.

    Like I said I think it should be looking at the votes not the items, it's formed a pretty clear middle right above 75%, it's not enough to go to the next number so it's simply 75%. It seems a lot more fair.

    This time it didn't work out too bad, 70% isn't bad but the fact 75% voted for 75+ and we still got a number lower than 75% is not ideal. If you would of voted 45% for example we'd have a attack cap of 60% or 65% right now right? 60-65% when 75% voted for 75+.
     
  10. FoxWMB

    FoxWMB Clubbed The Pit

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    I'm not saying my system was ideal, far from it, however calling it unfair is not correct. With this system, everyone's vote is weighted exactly the same. The idea was to have 75+% and determine mid value of that, but unfortunately it turned out that in order for it to be 75%, you have to pick one of the 3 options that had only 1 vote. So, I can either say that your vote weighs more than mine and ufbre's, that mine weighs more than your and ufbre's, or that his weigh more than both of ours - or I can include all 3 and make it perfectly fair.

    Now yeah, what you're saying would be very correct if the poll question was "do you want attack cap to be 75%, more, or less?" in that case, yeah, 3 people say yes, 3 people say more, 2 people say less, clear majority for 75% or more. However, that's just not the case here, here the question was how much you want it to be, and the end result is that it's within 10% of what majority wants, even better 7.5% if we go with the 72.5% version of the math (which I think we should) . It's 12.5% from what you wanted and 27.5% from what ufbre wanted.

    As I said, it's not ideal, but the end result is supposed to make the most people as close to satisfied as possible
     
  11. Aaddron

    Aaddron Moderator Staff Member GameOgre Moderator

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    Ok that is your opinion, if I can't say it's unfair, then you can't say it's fair either... it's not fact, it's opinion... I'm fine with that but don't start a my opinion is fact, yours is just opinion.

    Exactly what I'm getting at here... the most people satisfied. This other system gives 3 people exactly what they wanted. It goes 5% closer to the 3 above but it goes 5% further from the two that voted below. In yours it's 5% closer to the 2 lower votes and 5% further from the 6 higher votes. It just seems to favor lower votes... which seems unfair, that's all I'm saying.

    Whatever, this is not gonna go anywhere. Anyways you agree it's flawed, I already said I'm fine with it this time... it worked without hitting it's fault to hard but I think it shouldn't be used again. I put forward a alternative which you don't like which is fine... so do you have an alternative? :)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 9, 2013
  12. Thedarkboy

    Thedarkboy Anime Geek Ogre Veteran

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    I still don't think that adding everything, and dividing it with the number of people is fair. It might work for other thinks, but not this. One vote that's really low, could affect everything, even if almost everyone would vote for a much higher cap. Even though it would make everyone's vote be more important, I don't think it's fair that only two votes would lower it.
     
  13. Admin Post
    ogreman

    ogreman Ogre In Charge Staff Member GameOgre Admin

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    The attack cap is currently 72.

    72.5 was not possible. It just kicks off the .5 when I tried:).
     
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